amitymamaThe Attachment Parenting Community

BlsdMama · 02-28-2004, 05:53 PM

The formula is plain old Enfamil with iron.

Ingredients:
Nonfat milk, lactose, vegetable oil - the vegetable oil includes: palm, soy, coconut, and sunflower oils.

Yes, I do have a very forceful letdown. She has to let go of the nipple several times to avoid choking, but I think we've fixed that to. I just let the milk letdown and then take her off and let the milk go onto a diaper as suggested by several here. It actually seems to get stronger with each child. But I had a forceful letdown with Lizzie too and it never seemed to affect her.

I guess I'm going to have to do an elimination diet and then if nothing works, well I guess we're stuck. Well, this situation can humble a person pretty quickly can't it?

mamamicky · 02-28-2004, 05:53 PM

I would really encourage you to see an Internationally Board Certified Lactation consultant - one that is very experienced and has "seen it all". Call around and find out who has the best rep. in the city. It may cost you 70-80 dollars or more, but less than formula long term.

You may also need to do some genetic testing on your child to rule out some serious diseases if she can not tolerate your milk.

I second the person who said to cut everything out. Maybe eat rice and chicken and greenbeans for a week and see what happens.

As far as her pain, how about Gripe water, constant slinging, skin to skin, etc.

Hope this helps,
micky

jessica_momof7 · 02-28-2004, 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by mamamicky
I would really encourage you to see an Internationally Board Certified Lactation consultant - one that is very experienced and has "seen it all". Call around and find out who has the best rep. in the city. It may cost you 70-80 dollars or more, but less than formula long term.

I agree with a LC...but if you can't see one....I can tell you that all the information I gave you above and in the last time you posted was from them! LOL....

If you can't afford a LC....the hospital ones you delivered at should still be available to help (if you delivered in a hospital that is! LOL)

also, LLL can be a good help for this sometimes. My leaders were not the best here, but some of them are really good.

With the forceful let down, continue the squirting into a towel....Lizzie probably did not seem to have a problem with it before because she got used to it and could regulate it herself.

droolbucket · 02-28-2004, 06:12 PM

Well, I can't really say that I know a whole lot about this, as I am just starting the elimination diet myself. But, I am under the impression that a person can develop an intolerance or an allergy at any time.

Wheat can be a big one for a lot of babies/kids, and I think is harder than dairy to eliminate from your diet. I just went to the healthfood store and stocked up on wheatfree stuff - crackers, baking mix, snacky cereal, etc., to try to get us through the next few weeks.

It seems that the elimination diet would be the way to go, to at least rule that out. Eat a lot of rice, chicken, 100% rye crackers, spelt bread, beans, fish, veggies, oatmeal, non-citrus fruit, etc. The foods to avoid are: dairy, soy, wheat, yeast, tomatoes, citrus, peanuts, corn, eggs, coffee and tea, refined sugars, fruit juice, and food additives (artificial colors and flavors, etc.).

My situation is a bit different in that I am doing it for my toddler, who is still nursing, but not much. Since he turned 2 (almost a year ago), it seems like he is congested for a month or two at at ime, it goes away for a few weeks, and then it starts again. So we're doing this to see if it helps out.

My one experience with foods while nursing is that he seemed to tolerate everything pretty well, but did get fussy if I had a milkshake - it's like he could handle dairy, but not an overload of dairy. So even within a particular foodgroup there can be limits on what they can and can't tolerate. For instance, I've been told that butter, hard cheeses (like parmesan) and sometimes acidophilus yogurt can be tolerated by kids who are sensitive to dairy. But others can't even have anything with casein in it.

I'm sorry you're dealing with this - I too have always been militant about breastfeeding, so I know how hard this be for you.

Oh, and what to do in the meantime, while you are on the diet? Honestly, I would give her formula and continue to pump. You can try nursing after a week, and see what happens. Then two weeks, or something like that. But again, I really don't consider myself an expert on this, as I am just venturing into it myself.

Marina · 02-28-2004, 06:51 PM

and please don't overlook MSG! I had one of my 5 that I just could NOT find out what I was eating that was bothering him. I had cut my diet down to next to nothing. However, I wasn't vegetarian then, and bought lean ham from the deli. Well, it's loaded with MSG. Once I started reading labels and got it out of my diet he was perfectly fine. Eggs were also a problem with another of my children.

birthdance · 02-28-2004, 07:13 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by mamamicky

As far as her pain, how about Gripe water, constant slinging, skin to skin, etc.

I was going to say try these things as well. Many mamas have had good luck w/ gripe water, especially for the gassiness.

One of my LLL mamas had a baby who was severely allergic to peanuts. He exhibited the same symptoms you describe with your baby...the gassiness, the diahrrea, the fussiness. She saw everyone, us at LLL, an LC, her ped...she finally went to an allergist and they discovered it was a peanut allergy. Once she eliminated peanuts (and all tree nuts as well) and soy from her diet the problem got resolved. He happily weaned himself at 4 yrs!

Don't give up, mama. Try the elimination diet and do see an IBCLC.

Oh, and lots of (((hugs)))!!

Blessings,

LoriG · 02-28-2004, 07:34 PM

I was just reading this post and I thought of my friend that was having the same problems with her baby. The doctor did testing and said that the baby was allergic to the mother's milk (???). She's preg with #4 now and all her babies have had to have formula because of that.

TinyBabyBean · 02-28-2004, 08:01 PM

From what I have read the milk in formula is way different from the milk products for adults. The lactose is broken down.
A baby could have no reaction to a formula and could have a reaction to dairy products in your milk.
Someone correct me if I am wrong here.

Quote:

Originally posted by BlsdMama
droolbucket,

If you don't mind my asking a couple of questions.

Of the stuff you've read about breastfeeding and diet having to do with sensitivities - did you run across anything where the baby was okay with what was in the diet, but then *not* okay? For example - I *do* like chocolate. However, she hasn't shown any sensitivity to it previously. DH comes home with chocolate at least twice a week and now he is SoCal and I'm in Iowa (waiting for him!) and my chocolate consumption has cut down significantly - only two candybars in three weeks!! However, can kids be okay with something and then just all of a sudden be sensitive to it? Oh, and I know it's not milk because she can drink a milk based formula just fine.

Second question, have you come across anything that would give you some indication of how long these things can affect your milk?

snowymtnmama · 02-28-2004, 09:35 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BlsdMama
Okay - questions.
I agree it just *has* to be dietary. However, could it really be dairy if she can tolerate a milk based formula? I really wouldn't think so. She spent this last week almost entirely on formula and her diarrhea cleared up. Gave her breastmilk starting yesterday afternoon and it's baaaaack.

Also, while I'm doing the elimination do I continue to breastfeed? What about pain management for her?

Jessica,

Could you please relate your story?

YES. Breakdown of the formula is going to be different in her digestion than that of breastmilk. Not to mention, it may not necessarily be "dairy" like someone was saying. It may be certain things IN certain dairy products, like casin, etc....I know Trace did fine while nursing, and when i got pg and couldn't keep up with him we went to a cup of whole milk. It made him ABSOLUTELY miserable. Changed to soy milk, and rice milk and he does great. He's able to eat whole milk yogurt tho, how much sense does that make? lol

CONTINUE to breastfeed if you really want to make it work. (not trying to sway you one way or the other) but giving her formula will probably just impede her in a couple of ways. She'll get used to the nipple and want to nurse less, she's used to the easy letdown of the nipple and isn't managing your forceful letdown as much so she'll probably forget or battle with it, AND the going back and forth with formula/breast milk while she's having trouble is probably REALLY messing up her belly.

Try Hylands tables, Gripe water (WONDERFUL stuff), mylicon if necessary, warm compresses to her belly, frequent burping, massages for comfort, etc...til you get her back on trace. That and a bland elimination diet for a week or two til you kinda figure out what's going on. NO PEANUTS, that's a big allergen factor there. Nurse ON demand, hourly if necessary, one breast at a time as long as she wants. Have a nursing marathon for a day or two, cosleep if necessary to get her back on track nursing wise.

((((((hang in there))))))) i know its SO hard trying to figure out these precious angel babies! Hopefully something will help and you can figure out what's going on!!!

herc · 02-28-2004, 09:57 PM

hey

first, the 3 MAJOR culprits are egg, dairy and peanut-- these protiens pass into breastmilk whole, and are more difficult to digest. There are a lot of other things that =the baby could possibly be allergic to , but these are what I would cut out first. It very definaetly sound slike a food allergy to me-- if you can nursse on one side for several days i just dont think foremilk/hindmilk is your problem. Poor baby and mama--- getting a good start with breastfeeding can be hard sometimes-- ask me how I know that, lol. 2 years later we are going strong though-- the persistence paid off for, us.

i would love to try and help, or just be your cheerleader

I know things can be hard, and terribly frustrating, but it really will get better.

heather