DH read through some posts at Amity- the homesteading one. And I got yelled at. For days. days. days... he's still mad at me.

It's really a very weird feeling realizing I don't have any meaningful privacy anywhere. There isn't a conversation he doesn't walk in on, or criticize, or somehow find a way to stomp on. The papers on my desk- open, my mail, my friends, everything. it's not a good feeling at all.my bank account, come to think of it.

while I'm at it, no couples friends, for him to see that we are normal, not superior, inferior, one of a kind, alone, any of that.

ari

oh mama that sucks. people always need a place they can speak their minds and hearts, or just BS or blow off steam, without having to worry about their partner holding it against them. i hope y'all can work something out and you can have some private space somewhere (((ari)))

:eyes: That blows. Everybody needs privacy.

I am sorry Ari. That's awful. Everyone needs some space. Are you both doing this, or does he have secrets and you can't? That is the line between silly, and abusive in my eyes. {{{hugs}}}

Val

Are you both doing this, or does he have secrets and you can't? That is the line between silly, and abusive in my eyes. {{{hugs}}}

Val

Yeah. that. :(

:eyes: :hug:

:hug: :eyes:

Oh, Ari. I am so sorry. I am pretty sure that my Dh has come here and read my posts on occasion. Thankfully, he has been compassionate about it. Like, I think he must have read my post about nothing getting done on Father's Day because he came up with a list of stuff to do and did it all and kept mentioning how productive he had been. It may have been totally coincidental.

I am so sorry that you would be yelled at for expressing your feelings and using this as a place to vent. Sometimes I find that neccessary BEFORE I discuss stuff with my DH, and I would not like for him to read some of those posts.

Crap. I don't know what to say. I am sorry.

We don't have couples friends either. He has friends and I have friends and none of us get together as couples. Some of his friends have young families, so maybe he gets some idea that we are normal, but we also get, "[So and so]'s kids all buckle their own carseats" or go to bed at a particular hour, or whatever. My DH, the outgoing, life of the party, is decidedly backward when it comes to getting together with my friends' husbands, even our neighbors. It's almost weird.

There I go elmo-momming again.;)

I really am sorry, Ari.
2

thank you. I don't know what I am going to do.

You cannot Elmo on the internet. You can say interesting and worthwhile things, that illuminate my life, as well.

What's scary is that I did Elmo rant, a giant rant. AM kicked me off, and then I was signed off=line. I dread to think what would have happened if that had been posted. I was telling you all, people I trust in this conversation, and then....no....

ari

Ari, are you afraid of him? I'm sorry you are in such a rough place, whatever the case. :hug:

:hug: I'm sorry you have to deal with this Ari. :(

No, not reasonably afraid. Highly paranoid. He's okay.

He's normal. I basically ignored him for the last two weeks, not talking, sleeping early, keeping the kids out- reestablishing space. He didn't get called to the carpet, or resented openly- things his mom does- not prosecuted, in other words- and we are back to a more normal keel.

I did ask him, and basically, it was like an open purse on the counter. I had mentioned discussions, the computer was on and open, and he looked. He didn't expect to be forgiven. He was embarassed, and angry, too. I think it would be like if I read a letter he received if it was on the counter, but different than if I'd gone snooping. Does that make sense?

I've mentioned paranoia before? Okay, I've been thrown out of my house, at a young age, for things like getting accepted at college, rather than joining the military. Or, let's see, my sister's clothes were burned, and mine locked away, b/c they were the "wrong color." Or, let's see, every diary, even the one in hiding, found, and taken to a psychiatrist as evidence of my f&*ed up- ness. It said I didn't like my great- grandmother's funeral. That was the diary entry. Somehow, teenage girls are expected to enjoy funerals.

I don't know what someone is going to do with information. It has been pretty bad in the past, and it takes a while for me to think, " Oh, this is a normal person, not like anyone I know." You know? Getting threatened with psych wards b/c of a diary entry about an awful funeral- that's not normal, but that's what I grew up around. Or, threatened with the runaway home famous for molesting its charges, for applying to college. Things like that.

I don't tell dh this stuff- he doesn't want to hear it, I don't want to tell it, I don't know what to do with it- I mean, they look like normal people. They have professional jobs and volunteer activities. I'm probably finally looking normal- three kids and a husband- rather than the basket case they raised.

I know it sounds strange talking about "privacy" and "trust" in an open BBS forum, but that is how I feel. I've known ya'll for three years at this point. You each are consistent and kind and thoughtful. You aren't trying to pull a "power over"or "helpless supine" stunt. It's sort of like we are in the electronic light, and whoever else is in darkness- well, they aren't on the stage, or speaking- so it's a bit like having the bats of paranoia known and in a place, rather than not. Okay, that got lost- but do you see what I'm saying?

I find it really, really difficult to be open and present irl. I have been practicing here. Even something simple, like, " I have chicken pox. I went to the doctor, and I was diagnosed with chicken pox." A series of statements of facts, right? My family did not believe me- dh had to take pictures I mean, if you have a simple, observable thing- chicken pox- doubted and argued with- can you imagine things like " I think...I believe.... I like.... I love.... I am learning.....I enjoy.... I have a hard time with....." being believed, or validated?

Dh grew up like that, a bit, too. Not as extreme, but certainly- he gets it. He still gets nightmares.

I mean, it sounds stupid, but sometimes it's really distressing saying something here- something simple, and funny. I have to work to write down what I write, sometimes I'm close to having panic attacks.

Okay, now I've got the ceremonial Elmo doll. Would someone please take it, and begin their own speaking? This is all stuff I try to keep away from decent and civilized folk-it scares me, it makes me feel like I've got a visible growth on my face I've got to hide, and I resent it b/c it's not my insanity......... Elmo, get your Elmo...someone, please....

ari

Well, Ari, I think you completely rock for making it through all that and out the other side as a (relatively) normal, healthy, caring, loving person. I am SO proud of you. I know, I am just a stranger on the net, and my opinion ain't all that, but I still am, yk? You are an amazing person, who actively, voraciously, spends her whole life trying to better hers and those around her. I am in awe. :bow: :bow:

I totally get what you are talking about re: privacy and trust...I have privacy issues, as well, and not even validated by any real reason like you have, just cause I have an oversensitive ego, or something, but it took me like almost three years of being here and participating before I started really opening up, and even then, SO much stays hidden. You can imagine how much I freaked when they went and made the Marketplace public, and everything I had ever said in what I thought was the privacy of the circle of Amity friends was suddenly out there for whoever to find and read. :(

I am happy to read your relationship with dh isn't quite how it sounded in your OP...and I hope you know about Branwyn's yahoo club for Amity sisters who ever need help in situations like that. It's stickied on the Marketplace. But it sounds like you are working through things fine on your own. :) My dh prob would be embarrassed and angry, too, in that situation. He has MAJOR privacy issuses, as well, also for no apparent reason...getting info like where he is going when he walks out the door is like pulling teeth, lol.

And I can't believe you still have contact with your parents. Wow.

Thank you. Really, that is super- nice. Usually the response when I start talking about anything at all the least bit personal is " You really need to find a therapist."

Which is incredibly pissy to me, since (1) I'm poor, and therapists cost money, and (2) the records aren't private in the face of a lawsuit- and if you have a rear- ender that gives you whiplash, or something like that- you've got a lawsuit, and (3) the very last therapist I had doubted that my new boyfriend existed. Not, she doubted the quality of our relationship. She doubted his existence. Um. I have pictures- they are even of us, in the same room, snuggled up. He's not ectoplasmic, computer generated, or a cardboard cutout. At the time, I just thought it was freaky, me saying a perfectly normal sentence " I went out of town with my boyfriend" got met with " Now, ari, you need to quit lying about your situation. Your made up knight in shining armor is a delusion." um. never rescued, thank you very much. four years, a reasonably good paper trail- passports, even. I think that's hard to fake. I broke up with him, he still thinks I'm great.

Or the two day one I went to when I should have gone to LLL.

I really don't know how to find a therapist. I know that my friends find therapists, and they help. I had one assigned in college, and he was brilliant, and kept me in one piece. And yeah, it's not just me thinking he's brilliant- he runs the program now- lots of people think he's brilliant. Would I have to get randomly assigned someone, somehow, in the phonebook?

Dh was yelling b/c I didn't tell him about ds1 almost getting hit by a car. From where I'm standing, he WASN'T hit, and I don't want to worry dh. Also, the job thing. Which was fine, and led to more talking than we've done for a while. Like, he didn't know why I wasn't aiming for hospitals. (endemic mrsa) or why I'm not looking( impossible daycare)

I think I win the brittle award- I quit a temp job b/c I was pregnant and the office manager was recommending spanking, bottles, and cribs, and I felt, somehow, that I didn't want to be around that. Crazy? It's not like she's going to come to my house with a crib, ykwim?

I don't know- I think I value the time it takes to get to know each other, and that we can control our typing. It's like we get our face in words and thoughts and deeds, sometimes, rather than skin. I mean, I really don't trust a stranger to spout off about "What I'm about." b/c it always seems the "What" theory is way different than the practice. But we get to see the practice first, and then tentatively find our way to the theory.And, then, too, there's time for growth, and change, and there's a gentleness and appreciaton here. Like, there are some really charged discussions that I don't think could happen amongst strangers, or near acquaintances, since it takes so much to imagine someone else's heart, and appreciate their experience. Like, I really miss Sunflower Mama, I'm afraid she went away after some of the "home" threads, and I don't know that she knows the love and respect and admiration I have for her.

And also, we follow each other, bit by bit. I think that takes trust, and some choreography. Like- worm bins, or cloth tp, or cloth diapers, or goats. Or the lunch trays that Val wrote about, that I am eating my dinner off of, right now.

I kind of like the idea that someday we'll have a supercrunch meetup, and we'll get off the airplane, and have to hold up signs, and we'll all be happy to see each other, and we'll still have so much to learn we'll all stay up late talking. And we'll be so pleased, b/c the irl will be so much more amazing and funny and better than we could guess.

ari

I kind of like the idea that someday we'll have a supercrunch meetup, and we'll get off the airplane, and have to hold up signs, and we'll all be happy to see each other, and we'll still have so much to learn we'll all stay up late talking. And we'll be so pleased, b/c the irl will be so much more amazing and funny and better than we could guess.

ari
Oh f*ck Ari (T) I would love to have that day realized. OM goodness...how I would love that. We will get there soon if my intentions have anything to do with it. I am working on it every day. There is something about the energy of the mamas here that make me want to make the meetup happen in such a big way.

I am so sorry your dh read on here and was angry. I am so, so sorry. I am wondering why he feels so threatened.

Love to you , mama. And if you need *anything* absolutely anything..please let me know and I will see what I can do.

:heart: :rainbow:

{{{[hugs}}}} my sweet friend. I too have those same trust issues from similar things. Reading about your clothes getting burned because you got the wrong ones just made me gasp. I too got clothes burned, dumped into the shower (this was the strangest experience ever... but I don't want to take the Elmo doll just yet), doors taken away, stereo speakers taken away because music was on 5 minutes too late while I was in the shower... Ah yes, my friend. We are sisters; come from the same completely irrational parents who have decided that we are worth nothing and shocked when we grow up and don't believe it.

Glad to have you around my friend. Very glad. I think you are the first person in a long time to make me feel like others heal from this too. I have many other broken friends irl... and most havn't healed, dealing with (ok, pass the Elmo. I may as well break into song) drugs, custody battles, divorce, abuse, abusing... instead of trudging through, making their lives better, step by step, slowly but surely, crying and actually getting over things. Making things better and not worse with their memories of the abuse and brokeness.

Ok, so today, I am sending you some really good chocolate, a foot massage, and some lavender. I love lavender. :heart:

Ari, I'm so sorry that you are going through this. It seems that there are alot of messed up parents out there who in turn, messes up us kids. We are here for you to vent when ever you need to. We are kindred spirits.

love and blessings
angie

Thank you for the gentleness, and kindness. I am glad that each of us is putting our life together in a more mindful and compassionate pattern. I am glad there is something of a team- spirit, rather than loneliness complete.

Very many hugs to each and every one of you.

And, VaL- I thought I was the only one with the door taken off the hinges- it's just tooooo weeiirrdd. What were they thinking?!!

I guess the answer is "not thinking." I don't want what they did to be the story of my life- I want what I do to be the story of my life. I want it dissolved in compassion and wisdom, so that it dies with them in the grave, and the good parts live on. I am frustrated that it has taken this long to be even able to say some of this.

Now, can Elmo go back in his closet/drawing?

ari

:sadhug: