but why is everyone's answer always prayer and God? I feel frustrated by this. It proves that God is simply a crutch. Yes, it is hard to go through a transition of being a devout believer and no longer believing in God or any such HP. Yes, it is hard. Yes, my mind is crazy (not just over that, but it is a contributing factor). But the fact that I feel this way is not Punishment, nor does it prove any truth of a Creator.

It just..... is. It just is! I almost want to rejoice in that. But, my body/mind still remembers believing. It is SO HARD to let go completely. I feel so sad about it, b/c I want to let go. I think. I remember the comfort of feeling loved, of feeling listened to, of feeling vindicated even when the whole world was against me.

Now I'm utterly alone. But my pain doesn't prove anything, it just is.

I can't wait to be on the other side of this transition. I hope I will be someday. I really hate where I am right now.

Mary, I'm really sorry first of all that you're having such a hard time. I am sorry you hate where you are right now.

God is not a crutch. I am sorry you no longer believe in Him. I am very very sure - to my core - that He still believes in you.

You are not alone. Never. He is watching you, loving you and waiting for you to just ask for Him.
But of course thats not what you want to hear. Why is everyones answer prayer and God? Because He is the answer to everything. Its all there, in the bible, if you open your heart, your mind and your eyes and read the truth thats laid out in front of us.

Anyway, if you completely don't believe that there is a God, and that He loves you - then don't pray. Meditate instead. Go to a quiet place. CLose your eyes. And reflect. On yourself, on your life, on your goals, on your dreams, on ;your past - and really really listen. If you need to call it your 'inner voice' do that - but I will personally pray for you (i hope that is ok by you but even if its not i'll do it anyway lol) that you will hear what you need to hear to get through this.

REmember that poem? Footsteps in the sand...

One night a man had a dream.
He dreamed he was walking along
the beach with the Lord.

Across the dark sky flashed scenes from his life.
For each scene, he noticed
two sets of footprints in the sand,
one beloning to him and the other to the Lord.

When the last scene of his life flashed before him,
he looked back at the footprints in the sand.
He noticed that many times along the path of his life
there was only one set of footprints.
He also noticed that it happened at the
very lowest and saddest times in his life.
This bothered him and he questioned the Lord about it.

"Lord, you said that once I decided to follow you,
you'd walk with me all the way.
But I have noticed that during the most
troublesome times in my life there is
only one set of footprints.
I don't understand why when I needed you most
you would leave me."

The Lord replied "My precious, precious child,
I love you and would never leave you.
During your times of trial and suffereing,
when you see only one set of footprints in the sand,
it was then that I carried you."

:hug: Oh, Mary, I am so sorry you are feeling so much pain. I understand this isn't what you want to hear, but I cannot even imagine how lost I would feel if I didn't have God to lean on. He is not my crutch, he is my support.

He will always be there for you, if you decide to open the door and let him back in.

Much love to you...

Mary, I am so sorry you are in this place. I've been there. I don't believe in God either, I was raised Jewish and I just never believed. But I do believe in positive energy, the power of prayer...
When Aidra was a baby, and she had colic so bad...and we were on the most horrible elimination diet for a YEAR...dealing with all of our food allergies, I would spend time each night in the bath tub, in the dark, with a candle lit and I would clear my mind. Then I would imagine what positive change I would want to see.

In our case, I imagined myself and my daughters sitting down and eating a bunch of my favorite foods...salads, home made pizza, and an apple crisp...it was a moonlight picnic(I have no idea why that image came to mind) and then when we were done eating we would all hold hands a fly through the air. This is just were my meditation would take me, and it was a very powerful image. The image helped me channel my positive energy and not think of the negative.

Oh, the other mindful thing I did when I could feel negative thoughts sucking the energy out of me...I would go through a mental list in my head of everyone I could think of who had touched my life. My mom, dad, best friends, brother, teachers...and one by one I would say "I love you mom, I love you Dad, I love you Julia..." etc, etc...it was a long list. And believe me, I didn't like everyone on that list. It was so positive...and just turned my energy around.

Exercise helps too of course, eating right...blah, blah, blah.

Exercise helps too of course, eating right...blah, blah, blah.

I know those things but it's so bad right now I can't even do what I know. I don't know if it's self-defeat, or punishing myself, or what. I am so mad. My mind is so very dark sometimes, it scares me. I have been single parenting ALONE going on 4 yrs now. I just don't know how I can keep doing it. I just don't know how. It has sucked every last piece of me. The ppl who should be helping me aren't. I am just, gone.. in so many ways.

I will try that exercise Linda. I don't even know if I *can* do something as simple as that. But I will try that. I start nursing school soon and that is the one hope I have. I'm not sure how that will make parenting easier LOL. But at least I won't have to worry about when and if I will get child support, and I can afford to buy a house! That has been my biggest dream for many years.

Lisha and Barb.... I feel your absolute love and sincerity, and I thank you. You have beautiful testimonies. :heart:

:hug:

what about meditation? Meditation doesn't have to involve a hp or God or anything and it can be as effective as prayer.

what is going on that is leading to your feeling this way? What makes you feel whole right now? Looking at the night's sky? walking through nature? Song? Even some of those old lds hymns that might having nothing to do with God? And, just because you do not believe in a God doesn't mean that you cannot believe in love and connection with others and positive energy and the power of the trees and the sky and the wind. I find a lot of comfort in those things. Actually far more than I do in God.

:hug: Mary :hug:

The only thing I know to do is to focus on the moment. If you can't take a day at a time, just take a minute at a time. Everything passes. This time will too.

Blessings and hugs to you.

Natalia

Oh Honey, I'm so sorry that you're feeling like this. I really think you're just wonderful and I hope (pray? lol) that you'll find your way through this time. You're feeling burdened and lonely, and that's because you are burdened and lonely.

Could you kind of send your thoughts into the universe? Like, put your needs and thoughts out there through meditation, or writing a letter and burning it, or whatever, and maybe feeling less burdened that way? Somehow sharing your thoughts and fears, even with yourself, can make you feel better. Whether it's prayer or not, saying aloud what you need or feel can somehow give you a clarity or help answers come to you.

I wish I could help you. I truly care alot about you. If it's a matter of finding comfort, then maybe like Rebecca said, listening to music or reading scripture in and of themselves would offer the comfort. You know? Like not singing a hymn as a prayer to God, but because you like the song and it reminds you of family or love or whatever. I think when you're feeling depressed you have to use any tools available. LOL.

Kerri

:hug:

what about meditation? Meditation doesn't have to involve a hp or God or anything and it can be as effective as prayer.

what is going on that is leading to your feeling this way? What makes you feel whole right now? Looking at the night's sky? walking through nature? Song? Even some of those old lds hymns that might having nothing to do with God? And, just because you do not believe in a God doesn't mean that you cannot believe in love and connection with others and positive energy and the power of the trees and the sky and the wind. I find a lot of comfort in those things. Actually far more than I do in God.

I guess I don't understand how you meditate? Linda's description was good.. but are those thoughts just supposed to come automatically or something?

I guess I don't understand how you meditate? Linda's description was good.. but are those thoughts just supposed to come automatically or something?
There are books out there on meditation...I've never read one. First you need peace and quiet! THe key for me is to clear my mind. I used to have a really noisy mind, so when I tried to do this stuff would pop into my head like "I gotta pay the CC bill, or what am I going to make for dinner" SO a friend told me to do two things;

1) As the thoughts come into your head, you can just send them on their way...kind of like they are moving across a movie screen. DOn't let them annoy you...just send them on...
2) use a word you repeat over and over to help you focus your mind away from all of the clutter in your head that is getting in the way. My word is 'Ananda' which means universal love. So, in my head I chant 'Ananda, ananda, ananda...." for a long time if I need to. IT takes me a short while to quiet my mind these days. I was never good at meditation until I was so sick(desperate). Now, I am much better at being able to just find my happy place~lol!

Then if you want, you can just focus on happy stuff...stuff that makes you feel love and happiness...and/or you can do your own visualizations like I described above. It was necessary for *me* to visualize us well. You can do anything that feels right to you, yk?

Does that help a little bit?

hth!

I have nothing to add, but I do hope that you feel better soon. I hope you find what you are looking for.

I was just thinking, I know many of my friends have had great help with their depression with Pharmaceutical grade fish oils. THat is something that is easy to add to your diet and give it a try.

I was just thinking, I know many of my friends have had great help with their depression with Pharmaceutical grade fish oils. THat is something that is easy to add to your diet and give it a try.

I'm a veg so won't use fish oils. I did try something else.. not flax, but something.. didnt do a thing after a whole bottle.

Thanks for the basic idea of meditation. It sounds wacky. I mean, not to hear that other ppl do that, but I'm gonna feel like a freak LOL! What's another word or phrase I could use? I kind of like that idea, but I don't know how to come up w/my own. My current philosophy is one of secular humanism, so anything other-wordly isn't going to work for me. And how long should I spend during each meditation to start out with? I know I would find my groove later, but for now this is going to be a forced thing so I need a starting point. Come to think of it, there is actually a Zen center in my city! I forgot about that, I tried to go last yr but showed up on the wrong night.

I really didn't mean for this to be a post about depression per se.. this is so tied into my spiritual changes though.

There are books out there on meditation...I've never read one. First you need peace and quiet! THe key for me is to clear my mind. I used to have a really noisy mind, so when I tried to do this stuff would pop into my head like "I gotta pay the CC bill, or what am I going to make for dinner" SO a friend told me to do two things;

1) As the thoughts come into your head, you can just send them on their way...kind of like they are moving across a movie screen. DOn't let them annoy you...just send them on...
2) use a word you repeat over and over to help you focus your mind away from all of the clutter in your head that is getting in the way. My word is 'Ananda' which means universal love. So, in my head I chant 'Ananda, ananda, ananda...." for a long time if I need to. IT takes me a short while to quiet my mind these days. I was never good at meditation until I was so sick(desperate). Now, I am much better at being able to just find my happy place~lol!

Then if you want, you can just focus on happy stuff...stuff that makes you feel love and happiness...and/or you can do your own visualizations like I described above. It was necessary for *me* to visualize us well. You can do anything that feels right to you, yk?

Does that help a little bit?

hth!
what she said.

I'm a veg so won't use fish oils. I did try something else.. not flax, but something.. didnt do a thing after a whole bottle.

Thanks for the basic idea of meditation. It sounds wacky. I mean, not to hear that other ppl do that, but I'm gonna feel like a freak LOL! What's another word or phrase I could use? I kind of like that idea, but I don't know how to come up w/my own. My current philosophy is one of secular humanism, so anything other-wordly isn't going to work for me. And how long should I spend during each meditation to start out with? I know I would find my groove later, but for now this is going to be a forced thing so I need a starting point. Come to think of it, there is actually a Zen center in my city! I forgot about that, I tried to go last yr but showed up on the wrong night.

I really didn't mean for this to be a post about depression per se.. this is so tied into my spiritual changes though.

Meditation is a very spiritual thing for some, but it doesn't have to be. For you, think of it as a time to clear your head and relax. Play some gentle music if you like. I often meditate in the tub as it's the only quite place I have most of the time. I close my eyes and relax, focus on letting go of whatever it is that's bothering you. Inhaling positive thoughts and exhaling negative thoughts. Even if you have to say quietly in your head, " Inhale the positive, exhale the negative" Do what works for you. If you can only do it for 10 secs, Great, if longer, Great. The most important thing about meditation is that your comfortable. HTH ;)

I don't know your background or what you're going through -- but I can say that everyone, no matter what faith, goes through different growth moments -- and they can be very painful.

Maybe you just need to find your own way to relate to the Divine instead of searching out what others say is "the way", or "the truth" --- maybe you need to figure out your Way, your Truth.

Blessings to you!

Oh Mary,
I am not sure what you are going through, but I do beleive God and prayer are essential to me when I am struggling.
I do not have a beleif system I can say "yes, I am that and I am at home here" but as far as God goes, I beleive. And I dont beleive it is crutch. I think of God all day and night in spurts. I pray alot, but definately when times are hard and I need direction that I myself haven't a clue what is the wisest choice.
I think it woudl bbe incredibly difficult to not beleive.

Whatever you are going through right now, I hope your path will be lit up and that you will feel happy again soon.