I am having the worst time with my 7 yr old dd for the last couple of months. We have just started seeing a counselor and phycologist to see if there is something wrong with her?? ADHD, Sensory Issues, etc. They haven't been really helpful yet.

She is just a handful to say the least. She is blatantly disobedient and down right disrespectful. My dh and I do not talk disrespectful to each other, we do not yell at each other. We are a kind loving family.
For the last few days she has been grounded to her room until she can be respectful. I am not sure if this is the right thing or not, but I cannot handle her anymore. :(

I will just give you an example of tonight. She is sent to her room after school because of her down right disrespectfulness. Meaning yelling at us, telling us "NO, I am not going to do xxxx!" being mean to her brothers, etc. That goes somewhat well accept for us having to tell her to go back to her room that being grounded means you do not come out accept to go to the bathroom!

Bedtime comes and she takes a shower and then decides to get into her halloween costume instead of her pajamas. I asked her at 7:30 please get your pajamas on it is time to get ready for bed. Then I proceeded to put the boys to bed. At 7:45 I asked her again to get her pajamas on. Put Steven to bed! Come back at 8:00 and her pajamas STILL aren't on. I tell her again You need to get your pajamas on, her response is NO! I repeat again and she says NO! I then tell her she is not going to Girl Scout tomorrow, now get your pajamas on. She then starts to throw and absolute fit because she isn't going to girlscouts now. Finally at 8:20 after her fit she has her pajamas on. UGH!

(I did at one point just tell her that if that is what she wanted to wear to bed then to get in bed, but of course that was just another argument.)

I go in to get her in bed and she say, OH I didn't want to wear these one. I said, "NO you are going to wear those now get in bed!"

I know she just wants to start an argument, and at this point I am still handling it fairly well (not loosing my temper)

So then she looks right at my and tells me she isn't getting in bed. No, No, NO! (she just stand and looks right at me not budging)

Now at this point I am so frustrated, because I don't know what to do????:( I spanked her and she got in bed. Now, NO FLAMES PLEASE I know I shouldn't have done this, that I was doing in my anger and that it isn't okay:wah: I am just frustrated!!

So now she is in bed, but as she gets in bed she throws her pillow down. I pick it up for her and she throw it back down. So I kiss her goodnight and leave. She then starts YELLING I need a pilllow, I need a pillow. I went in a picked it up for her. Not a minute later she is yelling she needs a pillow...SHE THREW IT DOWN AGAIN:confused: I just let her yell for a while then I closed her door after telling her I will open it when she stops yelling. Then she starts yelling for her pillow and the door to be open. This goes on for a good 15 minutes or more before she finally stops yelling and I open her door.

She is now quiet, but not asleep so I am not out of the wood just yet.

I am just so run down by all this. This isn't a once in a blue moon thing, this is everyday all day long. She goes to school, and the house is pretty peaceful, but as soon as she comes home it turns to chaos. She is constantly making noise just to make noise. If something or someone is being loud she always has to be louder. She is always looking for an argument. She will ask us questions she knows is not going to be what she wants to hear and then throw a fit (crying whinning). When playing with the boys or even her friend she always has to be in control and control people (make them play what and how she wants to)

No discipline seems to work for her. We try taking privleges away, which just leads us to an absolute fit for at least 20-30minutes. (such as the girlscouts thing above) She just goes balistic! Can't listen to and is not willing to listen to anything you have to say. Then after all that she could really careless that it was taken away.
We have tried really focusing on the positive, trying to ignore the little bad behavior with out letting her get away with everything and catching her when she is good and making a big deal out of it.
We have done star charts and they work for awhile, but then she says she doesn't care if she doesn't get a star.
We have taken all her toys away and she could seriously careless. At first it was a huge fit, but now she doesn't really care. She has earned some things back, but most of her toys are still put away

I just feel so out of control and run down. I can't do this anymore!:(

Thanks if you have gotten this far. I am not sure what I am looking for in typing this, suggestions I guess? Maybe there is someone out there that has some answers for me.

:big hug:

Have you talked with her when she is calm, her about her behavior, and asked her why she acts the way she does towards you? Have you told her how it hurts you when she treats you like that, as well as pointing out that you don't treat her like that? Is she having problems at school that may be making her act out? It sounds like such a very frustrating time for you. I wish I had some fix-all advice for you.

(((HUGS))) i *totally* understand! My 7 yr old has been behaving very similarly, which has been really hard as our kids are usually so great. We can pinpoint when her behaviour chaged though (2 1/2 yrs ago - I had her younger sister AND we moved out of the house & away from her dad on the same day! It really shook her & even though her dad & I got back together again right away, it just was too much for her).

We also spanked out of desperation. I am so against it, yet got to a point where I just didnt care - I would do *anything*! We actually did it a few times. The first time got results, but never again.

We consulted our therapist (his specialty is marriage, but he also does family counseling) & that helped some. Our dd was homeschooled though & finally we put her into school(we knew that she would not misbehave at school - she *always* behaves around others). She started on Monday & already there has been a difference in her behaviour. If that changes, I have already told dh that we will take her to get counseling.

One thing i have noticed with my dd though is that she just really craves attention. She loves going out with just one if us & having a special day. Just holding her in my lap like a baby has calmed her down. It seems to me that when children misbehave & act out its a sign that something is troubling them. The key is figuring out what & figuring out how to fix it!

(((HUGS))) Good luck!

:hug: I'm sorry you and your dd are having such a hard time! I can really relate. I have one of those who's only 2.5. She has a diagnoses of PDD with probable Asperger's. We do "unmanagable" all day too. :rolleyes: I know it's so hard when you just want to love the child (and of course you do) but they make it so DIFFICULT sometimes. I just wish there were an easy way to fix it, but I really don't think there is. With a child like that, you just have to cherish the good days and try your best to weather the bad. kwim? I have had my least proud moments as a parent with her. Yes, I have even resorted to the all - evil spankings (a couple of spats with my open palm) a few times, too. There are moments when I have to walk away and breath because I just feel ready to explode. It's kind of like there are certain adults that bring out the worst you (personality conflicts or whatever) - I feel like I have a child like that. It's so sad. :wah: I love her so much it hurts, but sometimes I feel like I just can't "like" her. I just hope I can learn to be a better mother to her as she gets older - learn to understand her more. I hope one day she'll stop telling me daily that she hates me (and everyone else in the family). Good luck, mama. I understand how you feel!

Originally posted by Charity
:big hug:

Have you talked with her when she is calm, her about her behavior, and asked her why she acts the way she does towards you? Have you told her how it hurts you when she treats you like that, as well as pointing out that you don't treat her like that? Is she having problems at school that may be making her act out? It sounds like such a very frustrating time for you. I wish I had some fix-all advice for you.

I have tried, but she just laughs about it. Or does other things and doesn't listen so, I ususally end up just getting frustrated all over again:(

She does just fine in school. We did have a few incidents at the begining of the year with her kicking other kids at recess and on the bus, but nothing since the principle and I decided to send her home for the day to make a point it wasn't okay to be mean to other kids. Her teacher says she is great in class.

My Fianes middle daughter has add/ adhd .. she was still is terrible about tempertantrums and the you never listen to me, you make me do everything, and most annoyingly the lying to others( including telling her grandmother and mother that we made them do everything around the household while i sat around and did nothing ..there reply instead of checking with me and seeing what was going on was to tell her that she did not have to listen to me.. * smacks my head * okay i am the primary care giver and my fiance works 10 hour days ... Yeah thats good tell the kids they dont have to listen to me :mad:.. but i am vearing off subject) .. she had a big problem with doing things for negative attention.. both at home and at school .. she had been put on medicines before i moved here as well for ADD/ADHD.. of course her medicine was a must because she would not help to control her diet to reduce the amount of sugar she injested. Of course she resented her medicine because her mother had told her we made her take it because we thought that she was stupid ECT. *grr*

But anyways i sat down with her and talked to her about her add/adhd. Talked about how she could help herself so she might not have to take her medicine anymore. She said that she would like to not have to take her medicine anymore so we started her on a diet plan of low sugar with plenty of peanut butter and in the evenings a watery cup of coffee while she was doing her homework. We also encouranged her to get lots of excercise. WE set up a schedual so that she knew exactly what was expected of her every day , which is supposed to help add/adhd children focus. We also color coded her subjects, notebooks, and gave her highlighters to highlight her planner for each subject so she could get more organized. I drove the girls to and from school everyday because when we moved we decided to keep them in the same school til they finished with the school since they only had 2 more years, so every friday Kasey and I would go to each of her teachers and just touch base. Just so Kasey and i would know exactly what she needed to work on and so i could make sure she had all her homework in and so we could both know about upcoming projects so we could get the supplies we would need for them ahead of time, so Kasey would be less stressed trying to get them done so she could focus.

We would have snacks of no sugar added ice cream and no sugar added candies from time to time. I prefer Splenda because it tastes like sugar, but it is not like neutrasweet and other artificial sweeeteners. I would bake cookies with splenda even. Other snacks were cheese, nuts, fresh fruits and veggies, sour dough pretzels. But any time that she would have a carb she would have a dairy with it for some reason that helps to keep sugars from building up. I don't remember now it's been a while. I think that she had more "sweets" when she couldnt have sugar then when she could have sugar oddly enough *lol*

Also LOTS of possitive attention really worked... like when she would get dressed and then help her sister i would set her aside and thank her for being so helpful .. so then instead of thinking that she always had to do things to get negative attention she could do things to get possitive attention.. but also at the same time for the things that she did bad .. if it wasnt that bad she would get a no .. if it was moderate she would just get a i am very disapointed .. then if it was terrible to her room or she would have to do a chore then instead of something fun she wanted to do( if she sat there and would not do the chore then it was to her room) .She absolutely HATED that.. because if she threw a fit i would NOT go and baby her and talk to her. Expecially since room time ment no tv no playing with toys she could however read(which she hates to do) or take a short nap( if i peeped in and saw her napping i would let her nap about a half hour or so and then wake her up so that she would sleep that night ).

Even though she does not like reading if i would get a book from our local library that was at her level or even above which was interesting.. then me and her sisters would get all comfy in bed together and read .. i would read a page then they would take turns reading a page.. yes the youngest needed help with words and so did kasey .. but they got to build their vocabulary and they loved to be read to so it was great!That was the before bed activity instead of TV .. so they could relax and just calm down. It really helped !!

This really did help UNTIL she asked me not to go and talk with her teachers anymore cause it was embarassing to her.. then she was getting extra spending money for somewhere ( niether me or my fiance ) and spending it at lunch to by sugary foods, Then we started getting calls from her English teacher who had her after lunch.. Then she started to complain about not getting sugar. When it got to the point to where i was forcing her and it was no longer a positive thing i sat her down and talked to her. She was very distant to me then and told me she would rather go back on her meds then keep having no sugar.

(Some times i wish that there were no outside forces at work on the girls and that i was really their mother and that we lived far far away from my fiances family. ) If you can't find out what in your house is causing these problems you might want to look at what relatives.. other kids parents .. teachers.. ect are telling your child .. talk to her and listen to her.. if she doesn't want to talk then try again later... how i got Kasey to talk to me was i sat down with her and told her look we need to talk not as step mom to kid but person to person here ... she really appriciated that and it made her feel extra special. I started talking to her about her behaviors and what had been going on lately and how i felt .. and then i asked her how she felt about all that .. and she told me what she had been feeling and what was going on in her head and what was bothering her.. then i asked her if she would like to try something new to help her .. she asked me what .. and we went and looked on the internet together ( i had already had a kid friendly site together which talked about a child who had add/adhd and his struggle to control himself and what he did to become more focused.) I will have to look and see if i can find that one again it was really great and it might help you out .

Any changes in the home or her life in the past few months?

Have you read the spirited child book by Mary Sheedy Kurcinka?

Cherise, I'm so sorry you are having a difficult time right now. The first thing actually that popped in my mind was a hidden food allergy. But then, I would think that her behavior from that would be consistent everywhere, not just at home. The other thing that came to mind was it being just a "stage". Possibly from a major developmental/physical growth spurt... Is the only time she gets attention during her outbursts or disrespectfulness? I mean real one on one attention...just you and her or dh and her? I know it is so frustrating because it could just be one of a thousand different things. Maybe you could set aside a little one on one time with her on a regular basis for a while and see if you can talk to her about her behavior without coming right out and saying that's what you want to talk about. Instead ask questions about how she is feeling, how was her day, what did she do, who did she play with, anything that might bring up some underlying issue that may be there. KWIM? Don't come right out and say, "lets talk about your behavior", but instead try to get her to talk about what is going on in her head and what she is feeling. I hope things get better for you and please feel free to PM me whenever you want/need someone to talk to...I can give you my number too. Take care, talk to you soon!

:heart: I feel for you and your sweet daughter. My son "is" the same way probably 90% of the time but I do take some "credit" for that in ways I have dealt with him on certain behaviors.

First thing with your daughter that comes to my mind is that she is obviously needing attention. Has this been a long term problem? I would probably trace the behavior back and see just when it started to get a lot worse... Have there been any major changes in her life? How about injury? She may not have the tools or know how, to express what she feels to you.

I have a temper... I know this and I do say things I will regret for the rest of my life... but I also know that my boy is "in" there somewhere, if I have patience, hope, and maybe so sure "guts" on somedays, I am really able to get through to him and have a conversation. It may only be 5 minutes but hey, at least I got a glimpse into my boy.

In our case, this is what I have learned:
1. when he is at his worst, the most mean to his younger brother, and angry,... SOMETHING has happened at school, at a friends house, or he has misunderstood something said or done.
2. Once I figure this out, and my anger, upsetness, etc... is subsided, I will calmly ask him if someone said/did something....
3. He will 95% of the time tell me... and it usually is a bad comment, feeling inferior, teasing, etc... of that sort that he is frustrated about..he is so cute:he doesn't understand why everyone can't just get along!!! (nation's don't even have the answer to that one!)

(((hugs)) again and I hope she did finally get rest. YOU TO!

one more thing you might try, eliminating any junk food. My youngest is highly sensitive to Red Dye in foods... he will go balistic if he ingests anything with this in it.. usually fast food, convience type foods

:big hug:

You've gotten some great suggestions here!

Has she ever seen a psychologist? They can decide if she fits a diagnosis or if she is just having trouble aroud a specific stage. If there is any possible way, I would make an appointment. It's really therapeutic for mom and dad to vent too, and be understood. Good luck!

Another book suggestion (from our therapist, about my ADHD child) is Raising an Emotionally Intelligent Child by John Gottman.

Didn't get to read all the responses yet, but I have a daughter born a month after yours. I feel your pain mama. I am reading Love and Logic by Cline/Faye. I noticed that you probably could relinquish some power back to her, based on what I am reading.

Let me know if you want more details or want to pm me. We can chat more.

My 7 yr. old is the exact same way. She is a jekyl and hyde. One min. the nicest sweetest girl you'd ever want to know but the next she is mean as a snake and sooo disrespectful.
She yells, is horrible to her 5yr old sister, (not so much the 2 yr old though, she doesn't see her as a threat I guess), defies us, etc. etc. I get to that point of desperation too, where nothing has worked and my blood is boiling. Lately, I've been dealing with her a little better and my 2 yr. old is getting to me, but that's a whole 'nother topic, LOL.

I'm struggling too, and don't have any advice,

Just :big hug:
Lots of :heart:
and remember to breathe :)
Love, Carey

i don't know how you guys feel about nanny911, but i watched it last night. the dd had fits like that, the nanny told them she thinks its b/c the child was not being heard, so she would take out her frustrations on mom, by screaming yelling and trhowing fits. so what she suggested (& it worked) when she gets like that, sit down next to her, aask her questions, talk to her, but most important listen to her. don't talk to her from across the room & yell back, sit down talk find out what the "real" problem is. which i think is what most other mamas said. on the show she also pointed out that the mom didn't give the dd much praise for good things. i hth, it just reminded me of the show, so i thought i would share it.

My Emma sounds alot like your little girl. She has what is called "Oppositional Defiant Disorder" You can read more about it here. (http://www.docspeak.com/ODD/FAQS.htm#Exactly%20what%20is%20ODD) Emma has been diagnosed with a handful of problem, this being one of them, she also has ADHD, and ALOT of OCD tendencies. I know how it is to feel the way you do, :hug:

Maryssa is also 7 will be 8 in March and she is like your dd. Sometimes I just want to cry, I really dont know what to do for her. Maryssa is very well behaved in school, never gets in trouble etc. But as soon as we are home she turns into this child I dont know. I believe alot of Maryssa's problems are hormonal, she is going thru some early puberty issues. The littlest thing will set her off, :wah:

I am really trying to work on remaining calm and not demanding things of her. But it is really hard as I am pg and my hormones have me on edge much of the time.

Just wanted to let you know you are not alone, oh and many of her friends mom's tell me that they are having trouble with their dd's being disrespectful and mouthy.

Originally posted by ~Denise~
Any changes in the home or her life in the past few months?

Have you read the spirited child book by Mary Sheedy Kurcinka?
No changes that I can think of. She has always been a challenge, but we really started having problems the begining of summer.

Yes I have read this book, but it has been a few years ago, maybe I should revisit it.

The counselor also suggested "How to Talk so Kids will Listen and Listen so Kids will talk.
I haven't gotten this yet? Anyone have a copy?

Cherise, I'm so sorry you are having a difficult time right now. The first thing actually that popped in my mind was a hidden food allergy. But then, I would think that her behavior from that would be consistent everywhere, not just at home. The other thing that came to mind was it being just a "stage". Possibly from a major developmental/physical growth spurt... Is the only time she gets attention during her outbursts or disrespectfulness? I mean real one on one attention...just you and her or dh and her? I know it is so frustrating because it could just be one of a thousand different things. Maybe you could set aside a little one on one time with her on a regular basis for a while and see if you can talk to her about her behavior without coming right out and saying that's what you want to talk about. Instead ask questions about how she is feeling, how was her day, what did she do, who did she play with, anything that might bring up some underlying issue that may be there. KWIM? Don't come right out and say, "lets talk about your behavior", but instead try to get her to talk about what is going on in her head and what she is feeling. I hope things get better for you and please feel free to PM me whenever you want/need someone to talk to...I can give you my number too. Take care, talk to you soon!

I agree, I think there may be some food allergies. I have thought about trying the feingold diet? It seems so overwhelming. I am reading more about it. I need to look at the things she can have instead of all she can't have.
I have started to eliminate dairy and refined sugars.

I also think the one on one time is good and WOULD HELP. I need to set aside time just for her everyday. I know this is terrible, but the way she acts makes me not want to spend anytime with her. It seems to always end in me being frustrated.:( I am the adult though and need to just let it go!

My Emma sounds alot like your little girl. She has what is called "Oppositional Defiant Disorder" You can read more about it here. Emma has been diagnosed with a handful of problem, this being one of them, she also has ADHD, and ALOT of OCD tendencies. I know how it is to feel the way you do,
The counselor had mentioned this. I need to read more, because I have a hard time believing ODD? I am sure it is a real thing is just seems they are just defiant/stubborn and and it shouldn't be a disorder????
I did see this:What is the difference between an ODD child and a youngster who is just stubborn?

Stubborn youngsters know when to give it up. They don't continue with their stubbornness to the degree and point that it creates serious hardships for them. Stubbornness can even be an attribute, such as a resolve that can shine through in tough times. Not so with ODD, which, by nature of being a disorder, works against the child's best interest.

Any that is so her! So maybe??

So how do you deal with ODD?

Thanks to everyone that has responded, I am getting a lot of good information and things I will try.