John is 5 weeks old. Emma is 3 and a half years old. We are tandem nursing. I don't like it. I hate saying that, but it's true!

I HATE HATE HATE nursing them both at once (like in my sig picture!). It's just really hard for me to do!

But I'm just not enjoying nursing Emma anymore. She's so big and somewhat careless (ie - teeth digging into my nipples). And it seems that I am ALWAYS nursing one or the other. I want a few minutes each day where my boob is actually IN the bra!

Emma has been telling me that she won't nurse after her 4th birthday (April 12th). Should I believe her? If she really will be stopping in 5 months or so, I think I can make it that long. But, honestly, I'm not sure.

Would it be fair to limit her nursing to maybe 3 times a day or something? She loves having "tickets" to spend (for TV, etc). Would it be nuts to give her "nursing tickets" as well?

Any thoughts would be great!

I totally understand how you are feeling! I tandemed for several months and HATED it! I could not believe how IRRITATED I would become when my oldest nursling demanded it. It just made me want to run! I was completely shocked by my own feelings, too! i had nursed her during the pregnancy and never felt badly about it. I thought all would be warm and fuzzy after the new babe was here and I'd continue to nurse both.
We devised a "count-down"calendar.....a month in length....and after we had our morning nursing we put a sticker on the day until the GRAND FINALE! She got an enormous gift that day for "graduating" and being "all done" with nursing. She was fine that day but would have happily traded her big gift for some nursing time the following day. I held strong......we needed to be done.
In my mind....the irritation I felt was my body's way of telling me that I really should only be nursing one babe at that time...
Best Wishes! Christine

I have such a hard time figuring out what I want to do. Part of it is Lenora, Emma's best friend. She is 3 months older than Emma. A month ago her mom weaned her. It was very much against Lenora's wishes. EVERY DAY Lenora talks about it and has become extra needy! I fear that will happen to us. But, her mom is happier. I just don't know!

OK, part of it is that I am sick with a fever and headache and want someone to take care of ME! I admit that today is not the best day to make a decision on this! :)

i too find it to be -ummm... irritating at best and insanely irritated at worst. i also believe it is the bodies way of telling us we should only be nursing one at a time. as far as one being toddler and one newly born or much younger. i am sure it is different with twins. both times i tandem nursed- xylena & sarah and now sarah & gabriel. i really wanted to and want to quit nursing the older asap. i am not sure about the tickets. it may be a good idea. i say if you really want to continue nursing her- i find my emotional side does not want to wean sarah- then limit to 3 times a day or even 2 times or i think you will get touched out, stressed out, and wanting to wean her completely. i would like sarah to self wean but i don't want her to be nursing all day like she wants to.

Originally posted by TinyBabyBean
i would like sarah to self wean but i don't want her to be nursing all day like she wants to.

EXACTLY!!! That's it, I think! I don't mind nursing her. In fact, there are still times when I love to cuddle with her and nurse her and sing to her. But I just don't want to do it 6-8 times a day! I mean, good grief! So maybe I'll talk to her and we'll decide on two times that we'll nurse - like in the morning and when we get home from preschool or something.

hope this makes you feel better! your feelings are very natural and cross-culturally normal too...tandem nursing is not the norm in any culture even traditional ones...that's not to say there are not benefits from it but it is not a "human norm"....we are biologically driven to have a new baby only when the first is weaned..of course it doesn't happen that way these days always, but the biology is still the smae as it was through thousands or millions of years of evolution...so the frustrated feelings are there still, like a blueprint we can't escape from! not trying to say i don't have the ULTIMATE respect for mamas who tandem but trying to suport your perfectly normal feelings here!

also, i was a LLL leader for 10 years (just retired this summer) and i saw a survey of LLL leaders a few years ago oin Leaven, our magazine for leaders...anyway of 3,000 moms surveyed (all leaders) 75% reported a feeling "extremely frustrated or uncomfortable" while tandeming!!! so if LLLLs feel that way there must be some biological underpinning to your feelings...otherwise surely LLLLs could just "get over it", if anyone could, you know?

sorry so scattered nak

hope this helps

ps of course it is ok to limit nursing...you do have rights and bf should be pleasant for everyone involved! you can try making a rule about whatever really bothers you...onlu nursing one at a time, or only at certain times of the day...rewarding and praising is of course a great idea for this "big girl" behavior! you have nursed your daughter a wonderfully long time and she has the emotional capacity (with all the nurturing you have given her) to deal with a few limits so that bf is not miserable for you! much love mama.
joy

It's been 6 1/2 years ago since I tandem nursed, and I remember how hard it was at first. I felt like you do--that I was nursing 24/7 and it was really bothering me. My son was 2 1/2 when Elizabeth was born, and he went from nursing 2-3 times a day to nursing every time the baby did and then when the baby didn't too. UGH.

I kept pushing him away, and I remember him standing by my rocking chair, wailing "NURSE!!!" as I was nursing the baby. I had had it--i was ready to wean. I resented even holding Steven because he was so needy. I wasn't physically pushing him away, just mentally and I put limits on how often I'd nurse him.

Like you I had a friend who weaned her daughter about that time, and it didn't go well. Her daughter was clingy, whiny, and --well, everything that Steven was being.

So, I decided that for two weeks I would nurse him every time he asked. I woudn't say NO, I would do it with a joyful heart. I figured that he was feeling "replaced" with his new sister and maybe by filling up his "mommy tank" he would finally be satisfied.

Amazingly, after five days of this, he suddenly became his happy, sweet, outgoing and NOT NURSING MUCH self. Because he knew that mommy wouldn't say no all of the time, he was able to be happy and find ways to make himself happy without nursing. And when I would have to say "In a minute, " he understood that I would keep my word.

We went on to tandem nurse for 18 months. Steven said that when he turned 4 he would wean, and he did--the morning he woke up on his 4th birthday, he said, "Hey Mommy--I'm weaned!" and he was.

More....

Thank you all SO MUCH for your thoughts! It really helps to know that I'm not insane!

I guess I keep thinking about that fact that the average age for weaning worldwide is 4.2 years. But that is not necessarily a tandeming kid, huh? That JUST occurred to me!

Maybe I'll start mentioning a weaning party and let her think about some big horrible plastic toy she'd like as a present! :)

i would definetly limit it, otherwise I think you are going to wear yourself way too thin. Liam is down to bedtime and when he first wakes up, and my nipples have hurt SO badly during this pg that it is alllll i can do to let him nurse even then. I will nurse for a few min and say all done and he pops off. That isnt to say that he doesnt sometimes try again in 2 min, but unless he really really needs it, he is typically ok with it. We cut out daytime nursing completely unless he is tired or sick. That was just what I could deal with. And honeslty it has happened w minimal fuss. Special toys or snacks can also help, esp since you are nursing the baby-- she needs something to feel special too.

Man i so hope that Liam is weaed by the time this baby gets here. He barely nurses now, since there isnt milk anymore. I am really hoping that it will taper down to nothing before the baby gets here in April.
heather

CONTINUED...

Tandem nursing is hard. No doubt about it. But you know, looking back on those days, those are some of my most cherished memories. I'll never forget the tenderness in my son's face when he would "help" his sister latch on when she'd slip off, or when he sweetly reached across and held his sister's hand as they nursed together. I had hoped to tandem nurse the other two times we added a baby to our family--however, both girls nursed the last time before I was in labor, then never wanted to nurse again after that. (It's for the baby, they said.)

You'll do what is best for your family--follow your heart, mama. I just wanted to share that tandem nursing was a very positive experience for me, and to remind you that "This too shall pass."

I had the same issues too. My 2nd was born when my oldest was 20 months, and I tandem nursed for 1 1/2 years. After my oldest turned 3, I started talking to her about giving up her "nummies". It just felt weird when she nursed, and she's a long kid, it was awkward having her in my lap nursing, and older kids suck different than babies do. I think that was gave me what can best be called "queasy" feelings when nursing her. I could feel her tongue moving around, and I didn't like it.
So I did start to limit her, and have talks about getting to be a bigger girl, etc., and it worked great.

unfortunately, 4.2 years is no longer the worldwide age average for weaning. that's quite a dated figure the WHO used to use and it is helpful in convincing others that longer nursing is normal...but no longer accurate. think about it...in the u.s the average age of weaning is less than 6 months. you'd have to have a whole other population equal in number to u.s. early-weaned babies who nursed for over 7 years to make the 4.2 figure the average now. ::sigh:: the world has changed a lot in the last 50 years!

my own work into bf research (i'm out of school now for a while but bf and parenting, cross-cultural norms for both, was my master's thesis in anthropology) indicates that there are few attempts these days to get an average but that if we take all the stats we know of globally the average is somewhere under 2 years...like 18-24 months. sad huh?

anyway, you are doing great mama. don't try to hold yourself to any one ideal...you know what is working for you and your babies...you have bonded so well with them over these years! and you do what you need to do to make sure your new little one gets the mommying he needs too, just as you made sure emma did! part of the beauty of siblings is that there is the built in lesson for toddlers/pre-schoolers that babies come first! with love, emma can be gently guided into her new big girl world of helping to take care of baby too and realizing his needs, and mommies too. she will be so proud of herself if this is handled lovingly, as i know you will do! :heart:

my thoughts are with you mama!

joy

I weaned Kivett after tandem nursing for 6 months. I couldn't do it anymore. Aislinn was sleeping through the night, and he wasn't. I felt like I was being attacked. If Aislinn wasn't nursing, Kivett was. I yelled at Kivett one day, and that was my cue it needed to end. We decided on only nursing before bed (not even naps - he really didn't take them anymore anyways) and about a week later, started changing his night routine so that he wasn't nursing before bed anymore (he never really nursed to sleep). He still asked to nurse occasionally, and if I was feeling ok with it, I'd let him. After a while, he stopped asking.

It gave me the energy I needed to keep nursing Aislinn, and to be a good mama to the others.

I am very worried I am going to feel that way :( I am due in about 4 weeks or so and Owen is still nursing. At the beginning of the pregnancy it was VERY painful, but I handled it. Then it got to be ok and didn't bother me so much but the last week or maybe 2 has been awful. I would call it skin crawling at times when he nurses. I am sure its just hormones but I am worried it will be like this after the baby. He is only 2.5 and clearly not ready to give it up so I am just getting really nervous about what it will be like. He even told me when my milk dried up that "milk is broken" but he latched right back on. He nurses when he wakes up, 4-6 times during the day and to go to sleep most nights. I am just trying to think positively about this and hoping I will have a positive experience with tandeming

:big hug:

it's hard. i tandem'ed my boys for a little over a year. tucker just recently weaned, a few weeks after he turned 3. (he was just a week shy of 2 when griffin was born). your feelings are totally normal. the good news: it won't last forever, and when emma decides to stop, it will be bittersweet.
for tucker, it was totally a maturation process. he had a very difficult time when griffin was born. he had nursed quite often throughout the pg, and when my milk came in, he began to nurse like a newborn again. it was so hard to deal with.
over time, over the course of a year, i watched my baby boy grow into a big brother. i smile as i write that, with tears coming down my face. he is so tender and gentle and sweet to griffin. he is playful and protective and everything a big brother should be. one day, about a week after his third birthday, he began to call himself "the big brother" and "mama's big boy" and started to take on an entirely different role. he stopped nursing almost entirely -- he would ask to nurse and then laugh and say, "no mama, i'm such a big boy now. griff can nurse on my side." he has nursed twice since then -- both times it was early morning and he latched on, sucked maybe once, then just snuggled up and told me he loved me. :heart:
i know it is easier said than done, but one thing i know: i am **so** glad that tucker was able to wean on his own time. it is one gift i was able to give him that he will never ever forget. he knows the safety, security, and unconditional love of his mama's breast.
i would encourage you to hang in there, mama. especially if emma is talking about weaning. i think that when they begin to discuss it, it is monumental. they are thinking about the process -- what it means to them, to you, to the family. these precious nurslings of ours are awesome. their minds are so active and intuitive. your sweet little emma is letting you know that it won't be much longer. enjoy the rest of these moments. savor them. inhale them. i promise it is something you will *never* regret!!

earlier i forgot i wanted to add ways that help me with sarah. i did give in to all her asking for while but started getting frustrated with her. i didn't want to feel that way so realized i needed to limit. anyhow, the same things work that worked with xylena which was distracting her from nursing mostly. sometimes i will ask if she just wants to cuddle and that works, or a book since she loves when i read to her, or something to eat/drink. i actually usually offer the eat/drink first. and i learned not to ask if she wants one of the distracting items or she will say no! lol! i just have to offer it in a matter of fact way and it works most of the time. sometimes she really just wants to nurse and nothing works so i give in.

oh! playtime outside works too. and i have a chair out there so i can still sit to nurse gabriel and she will happily play. i think sometimes she is just bored. and by using the distractions i can figure out when she really does need to nurse or actually needs something else.

I'm sure it's different with an older one and a baby than twins - but I can relate to the feeling of wanting your boob back in the bra for at least a little while! My twins don't like to nurse together so I feel like I spent most of the day and night nursing. I've never nursed a toddler - but I'm thinking it would be o.k to limit it somewhat for your sanity.

I just wanted to add too, that she's probably extra needy right now since she's been thrust into a situation she hasn't dealt with before (sharing nursing, mommy, etc.). I'm not saying do or don't wean her, but do take that into account in your decision. Also, if you're getting sick or are sick, she may be fighting something off as well to make her needy. For me, tandemming or not, I'd go through phases where the thought of nursing made me want to scream. I'd convince myself to wait another week and see how I felt then and then take steps to wean if I still felt like it. For me when the week rolled around I had forgotten about being sick of nursing/tandemming, however if it hadn't I would have recognized my need to change something.
I did however limit Paul's nursing towards the end. We'd nurse to sleep, in the morning (so I could sleep a few more minutes) and at naptime. It sounds like you know your daughter's neediest times, and that's valuable information! Good luck in your decision.