I was just reading on the Natural Mama's Place about "toning down" your crunchy ideas around other less crunchy people.....

I realized how alone I really feel.

I am very very firm and committed to everything AP and find myself very off the spectrum when it comes to parenting, birth and health. I am less off the mainstream for foods but, by "normal" standards we are really different even then.
I have only one friend who is an EBF and co-sleeper, but that is it.
The rest of our long time friends etc. are VERY VERY mainstream and think BF for the full 12 months is radical.
I was just at a b-day party for a friends' dd who turned 3. It was painful to be there for me. I felt soooo unconnected to all of the other women there. Really more sad than anything. Sad for their kiddos, for the loss of friendship, and for having really nothing in common other than very surface things.
There were two other mamas there that we totally slamming homeschoolers, calling them freaks! WOW- I both home and public school my kids, I do what works, not a freak. One took a green pepper slice out of my 2 yo hand and said, "that is not for little girls, here have a cupcake instead"!
When I got home, I told my DH that I will not ever go to another party again. It will be his job. I just have gotten tired of pretending. I feel like I am watching life happening in these situations through a window, me on the outside.
I am soooo not being judgemental on what they are or are not doing, I just feel like an alien when I am around them. I am not shaken by thier lack of understanding but just have no interest in trying to keep up a "friendship" just because they are truly very nice people but nothing like me anymore.
It takes too much energy from me. I have to deal with this all day in my hospital job, I can not take it on a personal level too.
DH is supportive of me and the major decisions about our kids but is not all there with the smaller stuff. (Junk food etc.) He is still really good buds with some of the dads which is how I met the women......I need my own tribe. BOOOHOOO I want to live in a "Red Tent" culture!
Not sure the purpose of this post, maybe I am just hormonal right now.
Thanks for listening.
Karen

Just keep putting it out there... it will come to you if it is availabe. Really. I lived thinking I was the freak (and being a freak to the norm of my group) for YEARS... and then I moved to Oly where the main culture is pretty crunchy and if not at least they are "crunchy friendly"... lol... and now I have a HUGE friend group that have similar ideals and lots of things in common... I now feel for Don, who can't really relate to my friends at all, but just moved away from all of his. I sometimes wonder if I should have more mainstream friends because Don is more conservative than I... but he gets out of the house. So that is a big "bonus" of being the one that works, goes to school, does other things. If I did not have my friends I would go mad. And they all just came to me with in the last year. I had no one before that. And felt SO alone in the world. Put it out there... have you thought about starting a mamas group through a midwife? Or perhaps from a local food co-op or something? If all else fails, perhaps think about relocating to somewhere that supports you beliefs... I know that sounds extream, but I know what a huge difference it can make... and after all, if mama is happy, everyones happy.

Love Val

You know what's funny? My friend came over with her three kids to my house and the 3 years old broke into my room. My frined came up the stairs and saw-thje Family Bed. She looked at me strangely, and asked "Who sleeps in here?!) I said everybody. So-she thinks I'm a freak but that's okay. I KNOW what you're talking about. I am around moms who berate their kids, saying how much they can't stand them, can't wait 'til they'e 18, they speak of CIO for hours like it's okay.... I'm with Val. Keep putting it out there-let the others mamas know how YOU parent. You will convert someone! Or, at least , make them think, change, grow...

Karen {{{{{{{{{{HUGS}}}}}}}}}}}}}

We all need to feel like we belong. i don't think it is judgemental...

Keep putting it out there-you will find at least one friend who has lots in common with you.

And...I have to say-a couple of my friends-who were very mainstream before they had kids-listened a bit to my AP style of parenting-and they are co-sleeping, and AP parenting, and EBF...I am just SHOCKED! But hey-I rubbed off : ) I only ever spoke to them about my parenting choices and why I made them...i never suggested that my way works for anyone else...

So-you never know.

I agree-don't go to those yucky b-day parties...and next time someone takes a healthy food from your child, and replaces it with crap-pull them aside and tell them how you feel about that.

I feel compelled to tell this story-I don't know why but...One time I was heating up black eyed peas and collard greens for my dd-when she was 18 months old. (at dh's work) A co worker came along-and was talking to dd-he adores her-and when he saw what her lunch was he said "ewww...that doesn't look very good' I took dd to dh and went and found the guy. my heart was racing and I said"Please do not ever talk about my daughters food that way.She likes what I am giving her...she asks for it-and it is good for her. Children are very impressionable-and you have not right to decide for her what looks yummy or not!"

He apologized..and realized how horrible what he said was...

I know what you mean about the 'energy' it drains from you...the local moms group did the same to me. They are very nice women to me..but I couldn't bear to be around them ...they were modeling horrible parenting for my daughter...yelling, smacking, ignoring...threatening-every get together...too draining for me.

more HUGS...

Hi Karen,


I just had to respond. I'm not particulary "crunchy" but often feel alone. I am committed to AP, EBF and just being a darn good parent which doesn't seem to be all that popular in my "yuppie, yuppie" neighbourhood. I have nicknamed it "nanny central" but have been able to search out some like-minded people. My local LLL meeting has been particularly helpful especially the enrichment meetings which are more parenting-centered. I try to surround myself with supportive people and read a lot of AP stuff. I admit to feeling alone and depressed about how most children are parented. It breaks my heart to think about how many adults are going to have major attachment issues directly linked to the way they were parented. How sad for them, society, their future partners and their future children. Hopefully, people will notice our parenting style and a bit might rub off on them. Hopefully, our children will be wonderful partners and parents and help change the world a little bit at a time.

The way you parent, Karen, is EXTREMELY important to your children and to society as a whole. Keep plugging away. You're not alone.

Chris

Karen,

I know exactly what you mean. Prior to April of last year, I had insulated myself pretty well though. All my friends homeschooler, EBF, co-slept, etc. I mean a couple were even crunchier than me. And I made and effort to learn from them.

Well, in April I returned to work and my best friend moved across the country - all this in two-weeks time. Oh man, sending my girls to school was a huge change. Very few even slightly AP/crunchy moms. Spanking is rampant among the families we are now having to associate with some. I feel totally unsupported. Thankfully, I have been able to keep some friendships going from my pre-working days.

I have found the best place to find like-minded moms are organic food co-ops, LLL meetings, unschooling meetings, etc.

I am not shy about my views. I have stepped on some toes. Sorry if they don't like it.

Thanks Mamas!
You guys are all so supportive. TOOO bad you are not IRL close to me! I was having such a sad day when I posted. Coming in to work today and reading your posts made my morning!
I do have "friends" who do parent similar to the way we do, unfortunately, they are not hte ones we hang out with.
I wonder how you guys got to the next level of intimacy with some of the friends you have. The ones we hang out with, we have know for 10+ years. Our hubbys/kids all know each other etc.
The new mamas that I have met, all seem sooooo busy (like me) and it is hard to get to the same more than aquaitance level. KWIM.
I would hate to call them and seem like a desparate, AP stalker :D
Thanks again!
Karen

All you gotta do is try...when you are hanging out with them...get a feel for their schedules...see if you have any activities in common...etc. It is like dating...lol!

And-you can just give them a call-and ask them if they want to meet in the park with the kids...or some other activity. And/Or-you could try to plan a moms night out-only for moms...like dinner in a restaurant...that works really well. You can do that once a month. It is good to get a break from the kids and go out with other moms too : ) For one of our mom's night out we went to dinner and the Santa Fe Opera-it was fantastic.

Linda

AP Stalker......lol...... I love it!

I have felt much that same way. When I finally found a group of like-minded moms (parents actually - several sahd's in our playgroup) I was so excited! I got really discouraged though because it seemed like what you said - everyone is so busy (like me) and it takes time to build a friendship. Also, keep in mind that just because someone is like-minded in parenting doesn't guarantee that you will really connect on a 'deeper' level. What I finally did was to reach out to one or two people who I really felt that there is something 'more' there for us. A couple of playdates later I see that we are forming what could be a strong and lasting friendship. And as it turns out they were feeling much the same way I was - afraid to seem to needy or whatever.

Go ahead and take the 'risk'. Have a couple days in mind that you can plan to get together for a playdate. That is better than saying "call me and we will figure it out..." I know that for me, trying to call someone to plan is almost harder than actually doing something.

Hey Karen:

I know so exactly how you feel. I've always been a "pioneer" since my oldest was a little girl. I did AP and slept with my babies before there was a term for AP. The only thing I didn't know was slings..but I actually did wear my son Jacob in a snuggli pack 14 years ago because it kept him happy. My point is, someone in the community has to be the first one to do things, or the pioneer. Someone has to be courageous enough to stick to their ideals. AP is scientifically proven to be the best way to parent...but not everyone knows it because of our "independent" fostering society. But YOU are letting someone know about it and might change just one person.

I have to think that way, too, because I have moved into mainstream society from Santa Cruz Mtns in california where what I did was the NORM. Some places now, it's nice to know, it is normal to see someone BFing a 2/3/4 year old. YAY! I'm going to keep doing it here and people can keep staring. I'm too old to care!! My saving grace is that there is a Whole Foods here. There are these boards which helped me meet a whole group of local moms like me too :)

try MDC's finding your tribe if you want to see if there are more local moms like you, or post something here. I'm sure you'll be pleasantly surprised.

Hugs,

Keep looking!! There are other AP families out there. I was APing before I even knew there was a word for what I was doing. My oldest DD will be 14 in May. Way back then :), we natural birthed, cloth diapered, extended breastfed (no formula either), co-slept, No CIO, etc. In fact I did all this even BEFORE finding La Leche League. I just followed my heart. I also carried her in snuggli but made my own sling for my next baby born 21.5 months We also home-school.

I found my "life-long" and closest friends from La Leche League!!
I tried other "mothering" groups, but they were so painfully mainstream (wacking the kids for hitting another kid right in front of everyone, etc.) Some moms from LLL started play-groups over the years on & off as well.

It really is beneficial to our spirit to find like-minded people to spend some time with.

You are not alone!!

Kerri, mom to Amanda(13), Emma(12-Valentine's Day), Maddison(9), Jonah(7), Saige & Claire(3, ID Twins) & Teagan (Sept 2003)

I have beena mom since 1999 and have had no friends that are supportive or even interested in any part of my beliefs as a mom. It's very difficult. I live in Georgia now and have made no friends. We move to my dh's home town. They say anyone who saw a VW bus (in years past) thought he was back in town. There are some snubby girls here that I feel like I just can't blend with. Not to mention the grandparents that seem to go over my head and think I'm in agreement that the kids are going to public schools. So I am alone. But I have the dh who supports me and I him. He wants me to homeschool and that's basically the support I get-except for my mom who lives in Maine. Anyway-yall are inspiring-and you just don't know how some of us are out here, alone and standing strong by our babies....I have been at Amitys for 5 years now, reading more than posting, and it's had such an impact on my life. Where would I be as a mom without this board-it's pointed me in all the right directions(usually)
...I would be just floating down stream with the rest of them....

Takes me about a year to have a couple of "early-stage" friendships and definitely two years to have comfortable casual ones.

This is a problem because we've moved every year since my 3 year old was born.

Sometimes I feel like giving up, I'm too worn out to try and find a time when nobody's kid is napping and too tired to make small talk (I hate small talk). But its a gift to yourself and your kids to do the work and make the friends. Sometimes, out of the blue, your blessed with one of those instant connections (hasn't happened to me lately!)

I made lots of similarly minded friend in Brooklyn (gotta love Brooklyn) but none here. And oddly, very oddly, I'm actually starting to connect to this woman who ezzo's and spanks. I wrote off having a friendship right away because usually I can't get past that. But she's in a bad place and needs a friend and I just like her and this is just what she knows. We'd be friends if we weren't parents and I'm just hoping it will rub off, always can. We've been good so far about being able to talk about this stuff sympathetically and non-judgementally. We both know getting through the day as a mom of little ones is tough. And I want to be there for her son, modelling gentler more connected parenting.

Anyway, I'm still lonely for irl likeminded friends and I'm totally relating to how you feel.

Astoria