amitymamaThe Attachment Parenting Community

Chenning · 12-22-2005, 08:48 PM

Mamas, my oldest is going to be in 5 in March. We are homeschooling this year using Sonlight Pre-K and love it! Not doing much structured learning - mostly reading a lot, playing a lot, baking, crafting, etc. Well, he's going to be of "school age" next fall and dh and I have been looking at our options. I am willing to homeschool him, but I have a few genuine concerns. Forgive me if I seem paranoid and inexperienced (I am most likely both!), but I would love to have somebody to bounce these concerns off of and pick your brains for input, experience, wisdom, etc.

1) I am doing the take it year by year child by child approach to schooling. I am worried that by homeschooling Matthew for next year and beyond, and then transitioning him into private/public school later will be difficult. I guess that I'm worried that by homeschooling him, I'm making him "unfit" for other types of school. Make sense?
2) I worry that for all the wonderful reasons to homeschool that this will rub off on my son and that he will look at kids who go to school in a negative, judgmental way. I once met a 5 year old homeschooled child who was going on and on to me about how "Schools turn your mind into crud."
3) The regularity of seeing your friends. You don't have to convince me that homeschooled kids are socialized. I know that they often have a more realistic view of real life and society. However, school does offer the regularity of seeing your friends every day. I knwo that this is something we can still have, but it takes a lot more work. We are attending a hs playgroup on Mondays and love it! How have you dealt with this?

As you can tell, I am pretty sure that we want to hs, but I do waver often and have been sort of stressed out as Matthew reaches kindergarten age.

Natalia · 12-23-2005, 12:07 AM

Sounds like you are doing everything right.
1) We are also HSing year by year and I think transferring back to school would be about the same as transferring from any school to another. Some differences, but most kids will do fine.
2) I think that the negative talk will come only if you or others around your son talk negatively about school. I am homeschooling one child and have 2 in school and my philosophy is to do what is best (at least as far as I can see) for each child at this time -- as opposed to " every school is terrible for everyone."
3) I totally agree with this one and it is a struggle for us. There are no children close to us and my daughter would like to see children every day. For me, this is difficult to arrange though other parents seem to make it happen quite naturally. I hope you are one of the latter.

Best wishes on your journey.

Natalia

beanandpumpkin · 12-23-2005, 09:08 AM

1) If you are considering sending him to school in the nearish future (next few years), the only suggestion I'd have is NOT to unschool him. If you're using some sort of structure, I think it will be fine! If you were unschooling, though, I think 7 or 8 years old is too young to be suddenly thrown into a school where he would have to learn real quick about structure, etc.

2) Wow, what an outspoken 5 year old you met! I would say that that attitude definitely came from his parents. My son is turning 5 and we tell him that some moms and dads choose to homeschool, and some choose to send their kids to school. Of course we do throw in a few good things about homeschooling, but we try not to dwell on the "bad" things about school...becuase you just never know what might happen in the future, even if you are committed to homeschooling "all the way through," as we are. This is a way to experience that "different choices do not equal bad choices."

3) You are right in that if a child has friends in school, he or she is seeing them every day. However, he's also seeing the bullies every day, the "victims" every day, etc. He's also not necessarily playing with his friends every day for very long, because school is not a place "to socialize" or so my elementary school teachers told me! We try to do two or three playdates per week, but sometimes we're stuck home all week and some weeks it seems like our door is revolving with people coming and going constantly. I think it all evens out in the end.

DEandF · 12-23-2005, 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chenning

However, school does offer the regularity of seeing your friends every day.

Think about this-- when you're in school, you're supposed to sit quietly in class, probably next to someone whose last name starts with the same letter, and you are definitely not allowed to talk to your friends, if they're even in your class. A lot of schools have cut recess time down to a minimum, and if you're bad, then you might be kept in anyway. Once you do get outside with your friends, you have to deal with everyone else, bullies and bossy types who say things like "You can't play here" or "we don't want you on our team." Sounds like fun, doesn't it?

We have a park day, and the kids get bossy once in a while, but it resolves quickly. Nobody gets left out for long, and there's no playground full of other kids laughing at the one who's left out. We also do Campfire (with most of the same kids). Between the two activities (and he plays with the boy next door once in a while), ds seems pretty happy. I think we may add a class at the community center this spring, because it would give me time alone with dd, and ds would be learning from someone other than me. He also plays Dungeons and Dragons with dh (and other adults), and has friends (of all ages) at Ren Faire.

When I was a kid, my best friend lived across the street. We didn't even see each other at school, she was two grades ahead of me. My social time was after school.

lassie · 12-23-2005, 04:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chenning

1) I am doing the take it year by year child by child approach to schooling. I am worried that by homeschooling Matthew for next year and beyond, and then transitioning him into private/public school later will be difficult. I guess that I'm worried that by homeschooling him, I'm making him "unfit" for other types of school. Make sense?
2) I worry that for all the wonderful reasons to homeschool that this will rub off on my son and that he will look at kids who go to school in a negative, judgmental way. I once met a 5 year old homeschooled child who was going on and on to me about how "Schools turn your mind into crud."
3) The regularity of seeing your friends. You don't have to convince me that homeschooled kids are socialized. I know that they often have a more realistic view of real life and society. However, school does offer the regularity of seeing your friends every day. I knwo that this is something we can still have, but it takes a lot more work. We are attending a hs playgroup on Mondays and love it! How have you dealt with this?

My daughter will be 5 in June an dI stress about it too (mostly the pressure to send her to school). SO, I don't have any more experience than you do, but here are my thoughts anyway.

1.) I think it'll be fine as long as you have SOME sort of structure. One of my best friends was adamently opposed to EVER sending her kids to school, so therefore she wasn't trying to follow "school at home", etc. She just recently stuck two of them in school. They are in K and in 3rd and are doing fabulously. One of them is extremely shy and the other is very social, and both scored higher on their tests and are enjoying school.

2.) I think that child has heard his parents talking that way. I have a few little relatives that talk that way about h/s'ing and it really rubs me the wrong way. I teach Whitley that it is a choice every family makes for themselves. I don't mind her knowing some of the positives of homeschool over public school or whatever, but I am not gonna trash public school out of respect for others.

3.) I do worry about Whitley with social activites for several reasons. There are no girls her age at our church. There are no girls her age in our homeschool group. She is very social. Even so, *I* can't imagine sending *her* to school at her tender age. I think it would be more harmful for her than good. I also don't think it matters (personal opinion) if she sees kids every day. She has a sister she interacts with and hopefully will soon have another brother or sister. She does have plenty of friends, but they are either boys, or they are girls who are much older. For some reason she has two good friends that are 8 (and she is 4.5) but I think that's also one of the benefits of hs'ing. I doubt if either of these girls would have anything to do with her if they were public schooled.

mamajandtheboys · 12-23-2005, 05:16 PM

1. by homeschooling him, you will be giving him the opportunity to learn in a relaxed and comfortable place. he can go to the restroom without asking permission and have a snack when he's hungry -- not at a preassigned time. more importantly, he will be encouraged to learn, ask questions, and he will be fortunate enough to have his questions answered without distractions. i think my biggest problem with sending my curious son to school is that he is always asking questions, always wanting to know more --- and in a classroom setting, that behavior would be quickly labeled and he'd be instructed to sit still (something he simply cannot do for long periods) and be quiet. i don't want him to be quiet. i want him to explore the world and find out the answers to the questions he has! so as far as making him "unfit" for other types of schooling, you are

2. that five year old is obnoxious! children learn what they're taught. apparently, that child had some pretty vocal parents

--- i belong to a pretty large homeschool group with children from pre-k to age 16 and have never heard anything remotely conceited or arrogant coming from them. i think if you are open and honest about why you are hs'ing, he will pick up your attitudes about it and he can answer others honestly and discuss other schooling methods without being rude or offensive.
3. there are two sides to everything. i honestly don't want my children around other children unsupervised (by me). we don't allow a lot of things that others do --- others in our church and hs groups included. i don't want outside influences on them until they are older and can handle them with care and discretion. imo, seeing friends everyday is not a reason to send children to school.

C Park · 01-29-2006, 01:34 AM

I realize that everyone is entitled to their unique point of view, but as a
6th grade teacher and the father of 1.5 children , I do resent the comparison of school being a harsh rigid prison. Our motto in class is " the only stupid question is one that is not asked." There are many examples throughout the school day where students' questions lead to a learning experience. For students that have different learning styles, school curriculums are sophisticated enough to address student needs in a variety of methods.

Don't get me wrong. I will the first to admit that school is not perfect and cannot meet all individual eduational needs of all children ( However, is it not the parent's responsibility to fill in those gaps?)

I see school as more than just a place to gain knowledge and aquire basic skills. I believe that you learn a lot of life lessons and experiences there. You can't always set your own schedule or work only with people that you like in the real world. There are procedures that have to be followed, as well as having to adjust to new situations and social dynamics. You have to be able to function as a group. Some of these experiences can be enriching as well as be painful.

Remember the joke about everything you need in life you learn in kindergarden? I think there is some truth to that.

Chenning · 01-29-2006, 02:56 AM

Thank you all for your taking the time to reply to my post. Thank you, C Park, for your somewhat differing point of view as well. I used to be a 4th grade teacher before I had my first child.

I know that school is far from perfect, and has many negatives. My husband and I, however, feel that it's still a valuable experience for our children to go through at some point. Since we are planning to "mainstream" our children sometime in the future, it makes some of the decisions regarding homeschooling difficult. Does anyone have children who have successfully transferred to either private or public school? I'm not too concerned with academics, more whether your children ever felt like they "fit in" and were happy at school.

Katie · 01-29-2006, 04:59 AM

As long as you have a willingness to regularly re-evaluate (and take action) about what's best for your children, they should do just fine.

In spite of being a die-hard unschooler, I can see the benefit of a child being mainstreamed. However, if it isn't working, there really has to be a parental willingness to change the gig.

There are two groups of citizens that are mandated, by law, to be someplace that they may not want to be; school-aged children and felons.

There's nowhere in your adult life where you are required, by law, to endure your environment if you don't like it. Don't like your job? Get a new one. Want new neighbors? move. Changing degrees? transfer.

eta: I forgot to comment on the 5 year old. LOL. Hopefully his mama used that as a teaching opportunity for the child and a lesson learned for herself. I had a similar experience with dane when he was 4 yoa. Apparently I'd been a little too outspoken with my feelings about the president.

When you're passionate about a topic, they pick it up and turn into mocking birds.

djmdj · 01-29-2006, 09:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DEandF

Think about this-- when you're in school, you're supposed to sit quietly in class, probably next to someone whose last name starts with the same letter, and you are definitely not allowed to talk to your friends, if they're even in your class. A lot of schools have cut recess time down to a minimum, and if you're bad, then you might be kept in anyway. Once you do get outside with your friends, you have to deal with everyone else, bullies and bossy types who say things like "You can't play here" or "we don't want you on our team." Sounds like fun, doesn't it?

FWIW, our kids all go to public school, and it is nothing at all like what you describe. It never was - for any of them - and they are in grades 10, 6, and 5. I volunteered every week, and the kids had a great time in class. I taught a series of small reading groups in which the kids got to read, discuss, etc. As they moved from one activity to the other, there was time to talk and chat. They had two recesses, plus gym class. They ate together and talked. My children got to meet all kinds of different people: people with differeing abilities, people with different home situations, people with different backgrounds, people of different races, etc. Their seats were changed every three of four weeks, so that everyone eventually sat next to everyone.

Yes, there were times when they had to sit quietly, listen, and do work. Kind of like - well, regular life. They have to sit quietly in church, the movies, while doing homework at home, when we visit people with no kids, at plays or programs, etc. They have to work when they don't want to for their chores, homework, etc., just everyone does.

I think homeschooling ROCKS! But public school is not an evil enemy shaping children into little robotic soldiers either. Ds's class even wrote and published their own book!

Whatever is best for each family and child - that's what folks should do.

~Meeshi~ · 01-29-2006, 10:07 AM

That's not at all what schools are like in this area. I guess there is a LOT of room for variation, but locally our schools are very much like Deanna described. Recently there was a big hub-bub because gym is getting cut back, recess is basically non-existant, the bullying problems are escalating, and the amount of sugar being given out is astounding.

I wish there were the options of good schools in the area, but there's really not.

We do have several friends who teach in the elementary school and they are very vocal about the many, many downfalls they are seeing in the system.

You are lucky, Denise, to have such good schooling options available to you.

volvomom · 01-29-2006, 12:17 PM

but when my oldest two children were in Kindergarten and First Grade in the A Rated elementary school (that's how they rate schools in my state) behind my house they had to sit quietly almost all day! (I found that difficult and I am an adult!) The school says they have a zero bully policy but when I sat in each of my children's classes for a whole day I saw numerous examples of bullies and it was ignored by the teachers (not by me). Recess is everyday for K (15 minutes) and twice a week for 2nd-5th graders if there is *time*. This was in August 2003 so my observations are fairly current.

My oldest who is 9 is very social and will talk to anyone no matter their age. He has so much self esteem too! Yesterday at the park a group of boys waiting their turn to play baseball (Little League; there is a ball park attached to the park) came over to the playground to play. They at first watched my son, ignored him, called him names, and finally let him join in because their clique-ish attitudes rolled off his back like water on a duck! They even invited him to join in their practice!

My 6yo dd watches over the toddlers at the park like a mother hen. My 8 yo dd plays with everyone.

It's good to take it one year at a time. As your child gets older his education needs will change. I never found in school much individual attention paid to my education unless I wasn't getting good grades in whatever we Central Floridian children at a certain age were all required to learn at the same time in the same way. This is truly taking personal responsibility for your child's education.

*That being said I recall two teachers in my public school education who truly taught outside the box so of course there are some good teachers!

LifesaBeach · 01-29-2006, 03:37 PM

Chenning...

I think there are great teachers. Some schools have several great teachers. When you decide to put Matthew in school, as long as he has a great teacher, he will adapt. I'm sure that you and your dh are more than capable of preparing him and helping him with the process when the time comes...don't sell yourself short or worry too much.

I think sometimes the 'unkown' is more feared than it ought to be.

Chenning · 01-29-2006, 06:32 PM

Thanks guys :-)

Jennifer, thank you for reminding me to not worry too much about tomorrow. BTW, I finally just broke down and bought a syndicated Jedi robe from the costume store - LOL. It was $40! Can you believe it??? Crazy, huh?

Denise, you are blessed to have such wonderful schools in your area. Actually, the school that I used to teach at sounds a lot like the schools near you. My decision to homeschool for next year isn't because of bad schools near us - as that isn't the case. It is because I think that homeschooling is the best fit for my son and our family for this coming year.

Any other insight? Keep 'em coming. Dh and I are enjoying this thread.