Liberal Christian Mamas, could you come here please?

Discussion in 'Spiritual Discussions' started by Sunflower_Momma, Feb 28, 2010.

  1. MooseyMama

    MooseyMama Lovin' my life!!!!

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    I also consider myself a liberal Christian. Not sure how to put into words all I believe :) But I do know that I hold beliefs that other more conservative Christians disagree with.
  2. maxnmaizy

    maxnmaizy Seeking Light

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    Ok, first I ignored this thread, then curiosity made me read it. Some points are really resonating with me, so I will respond.

    In regards to Rebacca's call to let "liberal Christianity" be known, I have to share how much I have been touched in my life by this exact act. I grew up in a Church of Christ church. Almost everything I can remember about that church taints my view of Christianity. When I was able to escape the mandatory church attendance, I never looked back. (Well not never, but almost never.) After Max was born I got a job at a Lutheran church taking care of children in the nursery. There was no expectation to do any educational activities like bible storytelling or anything like that. I was able to take my babies to work with me, and the community fully embraced me. My involvement in this community gave me a vantage point of the church and the way they practiced their beliefs and I have to say I was completely shocked and amazed. The way the church committed themselves to inclusion, social justice, love, joy in faith, and many other aspects of religion that I was brought up to think were counter to Christianity. I worked at the church for 8 years and that community was a great asset to my family. Not only that, but it showed a side of Christianity that I could get down with (if I believed in all the other stuff like biblical teachings, Jesus and such, which I don't).

    I went back to the church last Sunday for a community celebration of a great project that they church took on and was only able to accomplish through partnerships throughout the greater community. A lot of the talk was about partnerships and building connections, and also about the place of church in the greater community. After the ceremony was over I was speaking to the pastor about this topic, and about renewal and regeneration. He told me how sad he was that the congregation is shrinking and how people in our region were just not interested in the message of Christianity. I replied that I see so much value in the work that this particular church is doing, and the need for exactly these types of Christians to use their voices, not only to talk the talk, but to walk the walk. And that I think that is exactly what this church is doing. This is why this thread had such resonance with me.


    Since I am here, let me share a quick example. James and I read an article about a Vietnnam vet who just came out to his vet support group about being gay. In the article the man shared how when he was a very young boy (5 or 8) that he heard about a man being arrested for being gay. His mother explained to him what gay means, and he knew that's exactly what he was. From then on every time he heard sirens or was around anyone with authority, he thought they were coming to get him and lock him up. After reading this, James and I were talking about how sad that is and how much it goes on all over the board and it is so insidious. Then James shared with me how he explicitly remembers the church he grew up in telling him that he would go to hell if he masturbated. He internalized this so much and was haunted with guilt and fear of eternal damnation every time he masturbated up into his early twenties (and that included at least of three years in the NAvy with no sexual contact with anyone but himself!). So there is one example. I know that this is not what this thread is about, but I thought I would just help make that connection of how insidious and hurtful some of aspects of Christianity can be.
  3. Sunflower_Momma

    Sunflower_Momma "Christian"

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    And, ladies, I think with all the drama surrounding my wish for a place I could think and discuss as I grow and deepen without having to defend and feel insufficient, that I've come to this not being the right place for me to have these discussions.

    I need the discussion. I don't need the drama. Thankfully, I have places where I can have the one without the other.

    :hippy:

    It just isn't worth it to do it here. The gains do not outweigh the cost.
  4. 3boysnagrl

    3boysnagrl Amity's Focus Member

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    Rebecca, I was really looking forward to the discussion... because I also have felt others (IRL) think I am not 'Christian enough' but yet at other times 'too much'. I have a very hard time finding Christians (IRL, mainly) who accept me without assuming I hold certain political/social stances that I do NOT hold.

    This discussion has led me to believe that I do have conservative theological beliefs - but much more liberal cultural/political beliefs.
  5. heythereheather

    heythereheather A reading family

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    I'm sorry, Rebecca. :hug: I know you didn't want a debate, or drama, at all. I'm sorry you couldn't get what you wanted, but I'm very glad you have places to meet your needs.
  6. OnTheBrink

    OnTheBrink Amity's Focus Member

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    Is there no way to have a discussion that doesn't include debate about definitions and such?

    There are plenty of threads about homeschooling that involve HSers sharing ideas and asking questions, but not debate from those of us who choose a different path for education. I don't participate in those threads because they aren't for me. Why can't this be like that?
  7. Sunflower_Momma

    Sunflower_Momma "Christian"

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    That was my hope. I really tried. Apparently, I failed. I do not say that dramatically. I'm not really all that sure what I could have done differently, but I'm sure that it would have been something.

    Off to put the kids to bed and then run some number of undetermined miles on my treadmill.

    :hippy:
  8. OnTheBrink

    OnTheBrink Amity's Focus Member

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    Grr. Well, maybe I'll start the thread, then!!
  9. heythereheather

    heythereheather A reading family

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    15! 15!

    Just kidding. That could be almost as torturous as this thread, then, to run 15 miles on a treadmill at night. ;)
  10. Robin

    Robin Jesus Follower

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    And I am sorry for this. I tried to bow out of this thread b/c I do not identify as liberal theologically.

    I started the revelation thread because something clicked in my head about why this bothered me. That thread ultimately was about my feelings and working them out.

    I started the third xtian thread because I want to hear what people believe and how that plays out in their personal lives and also how it pushes them in to "do" something.
  11. MissNairne

    MissNairne All new, with added NAK!

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    I have been feeling the same way Rebecca.
    It is too bad, but it is what it is I suppose.



    I must say I am more surprised by this turn than I thought I would be. If someone had asked me about a place where all spiritual, even Christian, beliefs and thoughts could be shared safely, I would have said Amity's.

    These threads are all just reinforcing the feeling that I have had for a couple of years now~ that I don't fit in anywhere spiritually.
  12. Sunflower_Momma

    Sunflower_Momma "Christian"

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    I only did 4.

    And, it was an interesting 4. I was just pissed for the first 2.5. So much so that I almost quit at that point, but decided to keep going and then I started problem solving much more efficiently and felt better by the end. I'm still angry, but my heart has softened.
  13. Sunflower_Momma

    Sunflower_Momma "Christian"

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    Robin, you aren't the reason why I'm currently frustrated. I find that you hold tight to your ideals and are very compassionate in the manner in which you do so and that compassion and respect is something that I appreciate and value.
  14. Sunflower_Momma

    Sunflower_Momma "Christian"

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    You do. I know that you do. I am sure that if we were to sit down together (and when I say "we," I actually mean the two of us), we would have a great discussion.

    I met with my pastor today. Prior to all of this, ironically. We talked about how I've been feeling and where I want to go and the work I want to do to get there. I do feel as if I have found a home where I do fit. And, I am sure that you can find a place as well. I know it. I KNOW that there is a place at the table for us. Even if it feels as if many don't want us there unless we meet THEIR (not JESUS') dress code. It is hard to want to join a group where one feels unwelcomed. But, I know Jesus wants you there. I know with every fiber of my being that Jesus loves and values and welcomes you at his table.

    I just wish that it were easier for those of us who feel as we do to have supportive conversations here because it would be easier.
  15. Tiffany

    Tiffany Amity's Focus Member

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    I'm sorry if it was me that made this thread dramatic, it wasn't my intent. I just think if you are comfortable in what you believe, then it doesn't matter what others think and where you lie on the religious spectrum. Be at peace with yourself and dance to your own tune.

    I may be ultra conservative, but evangelical I am not ;)
  16. Maura

    Maura Gene Genie

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    The more I try to "find" a religion which "fits" me, the more I believe this.
  17. DixieChick

    DixieChick One Hot Mama!

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    I'm sorry too. Rebecca, discuss away. I do not fit into the liberal Christian definition. Explore. Find what you wish. You obviously think I am wrong in my beliefs, so I won't impose them on you. All done. Back out of the spirituality forum again.
  18. Sunflower_Momma

    Sunflower_Momma "Christian"

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    Sigh. . . I am going to regret this, I know.

    I think you missed the entire point: I do not think that you are wrong in your beliefs. I am not, nor did I (really read my words) devalue the Orthodox Christian mamas. I think I was trying hard to give them the same amount of respect for their differing belief/approach as I wished they would give me and mine.

    I was simply trying to have a discussion with those of us who have a different (i.e., equally valid as yours) relationship with Christianity. Those of us who are Liberal Christians feel as if we cannot have discussions about Christianity without Orthodox Christian mamas jumping in and stating that our beliefs about whatever the topic we might be discussing are not "Christian" and we just need to be able to talk/process/share some of our thoughts.

    If the Orthodox mamas wanted to have a private discussion, I would absolutely respect that. If the Republican mamas wanted to have a private discussion, I would absolutely respect that. Same with mothers of teens, women with eating disorders, etc. I think that people with differing experiences at times need to be able to have a discussion only with those who are on the same page - doesn't make it more or less valid, just different - as there are times when said mama is feeling very vulnerable.
  19. DixieChick

    DixieChick One Hot Mama!

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    I agree completely. I promise not to convert you to my views while you discuss. I rarely even join in these conversations because I know I am an oddball. I've grown accustomed to it.

    I am sorry that my words hurt you. I reacted very strongly, and I should have cooled off. I apologize for my anger.

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